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The player character of the Saints Row series does not have a name, or a consistent title.
What title do you think should be used for the article about the main character? Please post any reasons for any particular title.
The article here on the player character was created as "The Silent Protagonist", before being renamed to "The Protagonist" when Saints Row 2 was released.
The problem with this is that the game never refers to the player as "The Protagonist", which makes it an odd choice for an article title. This wiki extensively uses the term "The Protagonist", simply due to it being the title of the article.
But nothing is set in stone, and there's no reason the article cannot be renamed to a more appropriate title.
The very first thing that the player is called in the series is "Playa", during the The Streets of Stilwater opening cutscene. Julius, Johnny and Dex often call the player "Playa", so it seems to be the choice which makes the most sense. The use of the slang spelling "Playa" is good, because the word "Playa" can be used to refer to the character, and the word "Player" can be safely used to refer to the user playing the game.
In Saints Row 2, and The Third, the Player is sometimes referred to as "Boss"
- "Boss" is never used in Saints Row.
- Unlike the word "Playa", "Boss" is used to refer to another character - Ben King is called "boss" by Tony Green.
- The term "Boss" is also used in the generic sense, as in "Gang Boss", whereas the word "playa" is always used when addressing the Player, and never generically.
Additionally, there is the matter of "Used most often".
- "Playa" is used 40 times in the series.
- "Boss" is used 23 times in the series.
Other obvious options are Player, Player Character or Main Character.
More discussion: Talk:The Protagonist#More Interesting Name.3F
I first posted this as a poll, but I realize that that was the wrong format for this discussion, because the reason behind the choice is more important than the choice itself, so please post your opinion here in the comments, as well as why you think that title is better.
Can anyone give a reason why "The Protagonist" article should not be renamed "Playa", since this is the most consistent thing the player character is called in the game?
Can anyone give any reason at all why the article should remain as "The Protagonist", given that this title is never used by the game?
- I think, the protagonist is better.
- TheMoonLightman, 2012-04-08T06:07:21Z
- Thanks, but what exactly makes it better?
- 452, 2012-04-09T03:51:44Z
- male : rory
- female ; amanda
- 22.214.171.124, 2012-04-08T17:22:21Z
- Sounds like somebody listened to my comment and ended the poll. Feels nice to be heard for once.
- 126.96.36.199, 2012-04-09T02:59:46Z
- I have looked at your edit history and cannot find any time that you were ignored in the past.
- Your comment was "Are we gonna end this vote soon? Or is this just going to be one of those everlasting polls that don't ever end?"
- That poll was only up for 3 weeks, there was no clear result, and we've never had any "everlasting polls that don't ever end". Every poll to date has been acted upon once there was a clear result, and no poll has been started before the previous one had ended.
- I would love to hear your opinion on the issue of the Player Character's article name.
- 452, 2012-04-09T03:50:52Z
- I have looked at your edit history and cannot find any time that you were ignored in the past.
- How about searching the following terms;
- Player, Main Character, Protagonist, Boss, Playa, Silent Protagonist and Playable Character
- all redirect to 'The Protagonist'?
- Short term solution, I know but it would stop confusion until a universal name can be chosen.
- Bravo315, 2012-04-11T00:09:28Z
- You have to think about a name that isa boy or girl name like for example "Sam"
- 188.8.131.52, 2012-04-13T23:44:49Z
- I'm not interesting in making up some random name, I'm just talking about what to call the article.
- 452, 2012-04-13T23:51:51Z
- it was during a mission it was a discussion with the protagonist about real names the protagonist called him/her "martha fucking stewart" obviously it's fake but it's the closest to an actual name as possible
- DBD Abyss, 2012-04-15T21:17:59Z
- no i was just saying it's the closest we have to a name
- DBD Abyss, 2012-04-15T22:48:43Z
- We're not looking for a name, we're looking for an article title.
- 452, 2012-04-15T22:55:00Z
- Assuming I'm not to late, I would like to cast my vote toward keeping the article "The Protagonist." It sounds more professional (yes I know this is the Saints Row wiki) than just playa, and maintains a level of gender neutrality that is missing in playa. Is playa a fun little bit because it refers to the PC and at the same time the actual player? Yes. But aside from that there is no unique quality to playa, which is a lable that can be applied to anyone, so its not really even a nick name. If the reasoning for using player is simply that it is the most frequently found "name" than you might as well name the page "You."
- The Dyre Wolf, 2012-04-26T03:24:36Z
- The term "The Protagonist" is never used in the game. "Playa" is.
- There is no unique quality to "You", which is a lable that can be applied to anyone, so its not really even a nick name. The term "You" is used many other times in the game, and is applied to many people.
- Only the Player Character is ever called "Playa" in the game, it isn't a label applied to anyone. It is a label applied solely to the Player Character.
- 452, 2012-04-26T08:19:28Z
- Exactly, there is no unique quality to "you" in the same way that there is no unique quality to playa. Many of the Saints could be called a playa because of the way the term is defined in real life; it would be similiar to naming the article dude because the term is non-exclusive. There is something to be said if the PC is the only character who's called playa throughout the entire series and was refered to such exclusively. Crackdown offers a similiar situation where the protagonist is a nameless character, but unlike Saints Row, Crackdown refers to its PC only as Agent. Thus it makes sense to refer to the PC as Agent, but in our case we don't have a PC that's called anyone name in such a manner. The PC is called Boss in both the 2nd and 3rd games more so than any other name, but we can't use that, because as you already noted, this was not the case in the first game.
- Then there is the flow of the article for example:
- This is just an example, and just consider removing "The Protagonist" from the article and replacing it with Playa. It sounds odd at the very least, and if we aren't willing to substitute Playa in the actual page, then why change the page name at all? Playa is not the characters name nor is it a nickname, just a way of addressing another individual. While the PC is never refered to as protagonist in the games, the PC is the protagonist of the series.
- The Dyre Wolf, 2012-04-26T17:33:49Z
- Excellent, this is exactly the kind of feedback I've been wanting. :)
- Apologies in advance for repeating myself.
- Exactly, there is no unique quality to "you" in the same way that there is no unique quality to playa.
- Playa is unique, because only the Player Character is ever called "Playa" in the game. It is never used to refer to anyone else.
- The word "you" is used by many characters to to refer to many characters, which makes it different.
- Many of the Saints could be called a playa because of the way the term is defined in real life; it would be similiar to naming the article dude because the term is non-exclusive.
- Correct, for real life, incorrect for the game.
- While the word "dude" retains it's common use in the game, and is non-exclusive, the term "Playa" is used exclusively to refer to the Player Character. No-one else is ever called Playa at any time in the series.
- Then there is the flow of the article for example:'
- Thankyou, this is the first good reason anyone has offered to keep "The Protagonist"
- Change "The Protagonist" to "Protagonist" and "Playa" to "The Playa" and reads it again. Dropping "Boss" in wouldn't read any better either.
- The example could easily be reworded to read better for "Playa", I'm not proposing a straight find/replace. I would reword the intro as :
- The Saints Row series concerns an unnamed character's adventures as a 3rd Street Saints gang member. In the first cutscene of the game, the player's character is called "Playa", and this is the most often used term to refer to the protagonist of the series.
- (I would move the extended referenced section to the description)
- Playa is not the characters name nor is it a nickname
- It is a nickname in the sense that it is how characters in the game refer to the character.
- The Protagonist is not the characters name, nor is it a nickname, nor is it ever used in the game.
- So there are more reasons not to use "The Protagonist", which is why other options are being considered.
- To sidestep the fact that Playa may not appear at all in Saints Row: The Third, there is another reason it wins over "Boss".
- "Playa" is used 40 times in the series.
- "Boss" is used 23 times in the series. Unlike the word "Playa", "Boss" is used to refer to another character - Green calls King "boss".
- 452, 2012-04-26T22:27:53Z
- I wasn't completely sure if playa had been directed toward anyone other than the PC, but thanks for clearing that up. Based on this part then I can see playa being alright, but I still have a few issues.
- Protagonist doesn't read any better than playa, but at the same time the PC is never called "The Playa" either. I realise that sounds odd, as we both know that "the protagonist" ia a name that never appears in game, but I think that's the big difference.
- If I were to say Master Chief is the protagonist of Halo, than "the" is still necessary for the sentence to sound natural. Playa as used in game is not accompanied by "the," so adding it is counter productive if changing the name is meant to use an in game source.
- This works for the example, but that was just a small part of the article. While it may be possible to re-write the entire page to replace the protagonist every or at least most eveytime, it would be hard to do so. It can't be replaced with just "playa" as previously mentioned and "the playa" doesn't work as mentioned above. So the problem of have a page named one thing, but calling the character another would still come up.
- The final reason I can see for using "the protagonist" over "playa" is that it might be easier for wiki users to find. Since several names can be linked to one page that's not as much of an issue, but I don't know that when searching people will look for either one. The first time I used the wiki I had no idea what to search for when looking up this exact topic, but when I saw "The Protagonist" it was fairly clear. I'm not sure that seeing playa would be as obvious, especially to new users.
- The Dyre Wolf, 2012-04-27T00:42:48Z
- Good point about the necessity of "The", and you're right that generally sentences do read better as "The Protagonist did this and that", than "Playa did this and that", and that "The Playa did this and that" doesn't really work.
- So in the end, you've done a pretty good job of convincing me that we're better off staying with "The Protagonist", simply because it reads better that way, thanks!
- At the moment, Player, Main Character,
Protagonist, Boss, Playa, and Playable Character all redirect, so hopefully it's a little easier than it used to be for people to find the right article.
- I hope you'll stick around, I'd love to hear your opinion on some other topics.
- edit: Link to "Protagonist" removed
- 452, 2012-04-27T01:03:09Z (last edited: 452, 2016-08-11T21:05:24Z)
- Glad I could help out
- The Dyre Wolf, 2012-04-28T01:18:29Z
- I believe that "The Boss" would be the most appropriate, as by Saints Row the Third, he is the Boss, and is referred to as such, Ironically and also I use this as an aexample, Naked Snake from the Metal Gear Solid series is known as "Big Boss" by the end of the series, not by his old name, and not by his debated real name, so The Boss is an appropriate title for the protagonist.
- TheRealTerminal, 2012-04-27T00:27:05Z
- I would love to know exactly how many times the term "Boss" is used in SRTT.
- I wish I'd suggested this a year ago, then SRTT wouldn't be an issue, and the solution would be clear.
- edit: *facepalm*, I've had the subtitle file for Saints Row The Third all along, haha - the word "boss" is used 5 times.
- 452, 2012-04-27T00:36:59Z
- As a followup -
- The Protagonist ?
- the Protagonist ?
- the protagonist ?
- 452, 2012-05-10T23:10:51Z
- $20 says that sooner or later someone will
suggest torename it to "President" or something similar.
- 452, 2013-06-08T00:06:24Z
- $20 says that I agree with you. So, erm, who pays us when we win?
- Moozipan Cheese, 2013-06-08T00:32:21Z
- Hey, if Saints Row IV is indeed going to be the last Saints Row game, maybe Volition will put us out of our misery and tell us the name. It's not like they didn't tease it a bunch of times in Saints Row: The Third. It'll probably never happen, but "A man can dream though, a man can dream..."
- Moozipan Cheese, 2013-06-08T21:45:40Z
- Perhaps the finale will take place at Trenzalore.
- edit: Now that I think about it... his name is a closely guarded secret, he is known by only a title, he came back from the dead with a different face, he always saves the day, possible time travel...
- edit: and constantly recruiting new companions...
- 452, 2013-06-08T22:18:09Z (last edited: 452, 2016-03-06T21:27:08Z)